Calendar:QA Chat:2007-08-09:Log

[18:30] <mschroeder> Let's start the QA chat.
[18:31] <mschroeder> I think we should have a test day next Tuesday.
[18:32] <mschroeder> What should we test/triage/verify?
[18:32] * ulf_ (ulf@moz-4811E34E.staroffice.de) has joined #calendar-qa
[18:32] <mschroeder> Hi ulf.
[18:32] <mschroeder> I think we should have a test day next Tuesday.
[18:32] <mschroeder> What should we test/triage/verify?
[18:33] <ulf_> Hi Martin
[18:33] * ctalbert (clint@moz-334F2010.mountainview.mozilla.com) has joined #calendar-qa
[18:33] <mschroeder> Hi Clint.
[18:33] <ctalbert> Hello
[18:34] <ctalbert> (sorry I'm late)
[18:34] <ulf_> Hi Clint!
[18:34] <ctalbert> Hi ulf
[18:34] <mschroeder> My last question to everyone was: What should we test/triage/verify next Tuesday?
[18:35] <ctalbert> We're back up to 217 unconfirmed bugs
[18:36] <ctalbert> But only 84 of those are not enhancement bugs
[18:36] <ulf_> anyway, working on unconfirmed seems a good idea
[18:36] <ulf_> what do others think?
[18:37] <ctalbert> Possibly.  I would think time might be better spent on the 26 QA Wanted bugs (most of which are unconfirmed)
[18:38] <ulf_> I'm referring to the test day
[18:38] <mschroeder> Okay, we have two items. First qawanted, second unconfirmed non-enhancement bugs.
[18:38] <ctalbert> And we could try to cut through the enhancement bugs, we could probably confirm ones that we want for 1.0, and leave the ones we don't want for 1.0 as unconfirmed.
[18:39] <ctalbert> I think we have a good enough idea of the roadmap to do that
[18:39] <ctalbert> ulf_:yes, doing QA Wanted bugs on test day is always difficult 
[18:39] <mschroeder> ctalbert: But isn't that better suited for a qa working session?
[18:39] <ctalbert> yes, I think so.
[18:40] <mschroeder> I talk about the enhancement bugs
[18:40] <ctalbert> oh, I was talking about qa wanted
[18:40] <ctalbert> :-)
[18:41] <ctalbert> Yeah, enhancement bugs are probably easier to address in a working session, I agree
[18:42] <ulf_> so when is the next qa working session?
[18:42] <mschroeder> I won't be available in the week from 20th to 25th August.
[18:43] <ulf_> what about next week?
[18:43] <ctalbert> Next week is the mozilla on-site meetings.  I will be more available on Monday and Friday and pretty much unavailable from Tues-Thurs.
[18:44] <ctalbert> By next weekend, I should have my network set up at my house, so I can work on the weekend too.
[18:44] <ulf_> how about Monday?
[18:44] <ctalbert> ok
[18:44] <mschroeder> okay
[18:44] <ulf_> at which time?
[18:45] <ctalbert> How early do you want to start?  
[18:45] <ulf_> ctalbert: I think that depends on you
[18:46] <mschroeder> I'm avaible nearly 24 hours. ;)
[18:46] <ulf_> wow!!
[18:47] <Fallen> semseter vacation, eh? :)
[18:47] <ctalbert> How about 15:30 Berlin time?
[18:47] <ulf_> I'd prefer to start in the morning hours (pst), that would be around noon in Berlin
[18:47] <mschroeder> ctalbert: That'S 8am for you?
[18:47] <ulf_> is it??
[18:47] <ctalbert> Geez...looking at http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meetingtime.html?month=8&day=9&year=2007&pa=37&pa=224 I realize I am on the otherside of the planet from ya'll.
[18:48] <ctalbert> No, it's 6:30 AM
[18:48] <ulf_> hooou
[18:48] <ctalbert> coffee is my friend
[18:48] <ctalbert> ;-)
[18:49] <ctalbert> noon Berlin == 3AM here.  I love ya'll, and all, but not that much. ;-)
[18:49] <ulf_> ok, sorry
[18:49] <ctalbert> no worries.
[18:50] * ctalbert is not as young as mschroeder anymore
[18:50] <mschroeder> Fallen: you're right :)
[18:50] <ctalbert> Will 15:00 or 15:30 work out for ya'll?  You could start earlier, and I could join the effort around then
[18:50] * mickey is getting clint a walking stick when he's next time in germany...
[18:50] <ctalbert> lol
[18:51] <ctalbert> awesome!
[18:51] <mickey> *g*
[18:51] <ulf_> ok, 15.00 or 15.30 is ok with me
[18:52] <mschroeder> So, what's left for the test day then... unconfirmed non-enhancement bugs
[18:53] <ctalbert> sounds good.  Maybe some ad-hoc testing too would be good.
[18:54] <ulf_> sure, that's always welcome
[18:54] <Fallen> some bug fixing would be great. We should encourage people to learn javascript
[18:54] <Fallen> :)
[18:55] <ctalbert> Fallen: I know you're joking, but what if we did have an interactive course on how to write automated tests, like easy XPCShell javascript based tests?
[18:55] <ctalbert> Can you actually do a "lecture" through IRC?
[18:55] <ctalbert> Maybe if we also webcast a presentation....
[18:56] <Fallen> I do believe its possible, to be honest I was only half joking :) We should prepare that a bit more though and put up some blog posts or such.
[18:56] <ctalbert> mschroeder: there's a test day idea!
[18:56] <ctalbert> ;-)
[18:57] <ctalbert> Yeah, it would involve some preparation and some serious publicity
[18:57] <Fallen> unfortunatly, most unit tests require understanding of the code thats being tested
[18:57] <mschroeder> I think, we will have unit tests writing days in the future. But I have to write some of them myself before organizing it. ;)
[18:58] <ctalbert> Fallen that's true, but I think our IDL's are pretty well documented.
[18:58] <ctalbert> mschroeder: me too! :-)
[18:59] <mschroeder> Maybe collecting test ideas and old fixed bugs is also feasible.
[18:59] <Fallen> yes, the idls, that may be a start
[19:00] <mschroeder> Some look for test cases, some actually write those unit tests.
[19:00] <ctalbert> mschroeder: that's true.  We could also encourage people to do some verification of bugs at this next test day too.  We have thousands of fixed, unverified bugs
[19:01] * Archaeopteryx (itsme@moz-84B741E8.cust.blue-cable.de) has joined #calendar-qa
[19:01] * ctalbert waves at Archaeopteryx 
[19:01] <mschroeder> Hi Archaeopteryx
[19:01] <Archaeopteryx> hi
[19:01] <Archaeopteryx> sorry, had to be in the train today
[19:04] <mschroeder> Archaeopteryx: We'll have a QA working session on Monday, 15:30 (Berlin time ;)) and a test day on Tuesday.
[19:04] <Archaeopteryx> thank you
[19:05] <mschroeder> We have "Discuss the proposed blocking bugs for 0.7" on our agenda.
[19:06] <ulf_> just wanted to ask whether anyone is interested in continuing w. that
[19:06] <ctalbert> Do we want to run through them quickly?
[19:07] <ulf_> sure
[19:07] <ctalbert> mschroeder: ?
[19:08] <ctalbert> (want to run through the bugs?)
[19:08] <mschroeder> Should we start at the top of the list?
[19:08] <ctalbert> ok
[19:08] <Archaeopteryx> link?
[19:08] <ulf_> I'm not sure where we were last week, but I guess bug 354951 should be next; is that correct?
[19:08] <mschroeder> Archaeopteryx: http://tinyurl.com/26eemc
[19:08] <firebot> ulf_: Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=354951 nor, --, ---, nobody@mozilla.org, NEW, ICS import fails in ip_parseFromStream [in nsIScriptableUnicodeConverter.convertFromByteArray]
[19:08] <Archaeopteryx> thx
[19:10] <mschroeder> Let's simply start with that bug.
[19:10] <ulf_> ok, if you prefer let's start from the top of the list
[19:10] <ulf_> that's bug 195580
[19:10] <firebot> ulf_: Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=195580 nor, --, ---, nobody@mozilla.org, NEW, Can't use delete button and key to delete task or calendar
[19:10] <ctalbert> 354951 seems rather bad: comment 18 is especially worrisome
[19:11] <ctalbert> he probably has odd encodings on some of those space characters that is throwing things off
[19:11] <mschroeder> I think, a decision on what the desired behavior should be is missing.
[19:12] <Archaeopteryx> could some compare to the specifications, modify the ics if needed and test it with evolution?
[19:14] <ulf_> the question remains whether this one should block 0.7, means someone should really have the resources for fixing
[19:14] <ctalbert> I can check the spec again.  But, I think this should block 0.7 once we have a clear decision on how to fix it.
[19:15] <mschroeder> +1
[19:15] <ulf_> I'm not that much of a fan of smth popping up, as suggested in Comment #9
[19:16] <ulf_> should UserExperience e.g. Christian work on a suggestion
[19:17] <ctalbert> I'm not either, I'd rather just replace the characters if we can't convert them to UTF-8.  Here is what the spec says on this: http://mozilla.pastebin.com/m7fdbbf01
[19:17] * ssitter (chatzilla@moz-859536C5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #calendar-qa
[19:17] * mickey (chatzilla@moz-11F63C02.pools.arcor-ip.net) Quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.6/2007072518])
[19:19] <ulf_> fine, thx!
[19:19] <mschroeder> I think, we need at least a warning dialog.
[19:19] <mschroeder> but no dialog with choices
[19:20] <ctalbert> I could see that.  That way they aren't quite as surprised when they see the ?'s
[19:21] <daniel> i.e. nsIConverterInputStream.DEFAULT_REPLACEMENT_CHARACTER
[19:22] <mschroeder> ctalbert: that was my intention
[19:22] <ctalbert> daniel: sounds like we have a solution -- shall we set blocking to +
[19:23] <daniel> woh'll do it?
[19:23] <daniel> s/woh/who
[19:23] <Fallen> we could make the import dialog a wizard, then it might also fit in better with thunderbird
[19:23] <Fallen> and we dont need an extra popup
[19:23] <mschroeder> even better :)
[19:24] <Fallen> ideally integrate it into the tb import wizard (I filed a bug on that)
[19:24] * daniel sounds like we have a volunteer? ;)
[19:24] <Fallen> heh :-} I knew that was coming ;)
[19:24] <ctalbert> :-)
[19:24] <daniel> :)
[19:24] <ctalbert> Sold to Fallen!
[19:24] * daniel congrats!
[19:25] <mschroeder> You can't talk about solutions without being enslaved. ;)
[19:25] * Fallen looks in his wallet. I don't know if I have that much free time in cash, I'll have to look on the bank.
[19:26] <Archaeopteryx> exams are over, you have
[19:27] <Fallen> not quite, oral exam october 1st for my vordiplom, and I'd like to enjoy my trip to the US in september ;)
[19:28] <Archaeopteryx> as long as you take your notebook with you, no problem
[19:28] <ulf_> :-)
[19:28] <Archaeopteryx> continue qa?
[19:29] <ulf_> shall we continue w. bug 356505?
[19:29] <firebot> ulf_: Bug https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=356505 nor, --, ---, nobody@mozilla.org, NEW, Date picker freezes (e.g., if popup month-list, then popup-year-list without clicking month)
[19:29] * mschroeder has also an oral exam in October, but it's already diplom :(
[19:30] <Fallen> can someone create the bug with the default character stuff? Or morph the one I filed about thunderbird integration? I'm quite busy atm
[19:31] <ctalbert> I can look into it.  I'm doing mostly calendar stuff today for a while
[19:32] <mschroeder> 356505 ist 0.7- IMO
[19:32] <ctalbert> I think we have to get these datepicker issues fixed for 0.7
[19:32] <ctalbert> That is crucial UI for normal users
[19:32] <ctalbert> i.e. not power users that tab through dialogs and type in dates
[19:33] * ctalbert would even hold the release to have those fixed (if it were up to me)
[19:34] <ulf_> agreed from the qa point of view
[19:34] <mschroeder> oh, I haven't seen the comment about this happening in the event dialog
[19:34] <Archaeopteryx> shouldn't be to difficult to fix (probably event listener prob)
[19:34] <daniel> yes, the basics must work
[19:35] <ctalbert> problem is, I don't know if we have anyone who is familiar with those things enough to track them down
[19:35] <daniel> after all, it's a very common control
[19:35] <ctalbert> Does anyone know how to contact gekacheka?  He seems to be knowledgable about these things
[19:35] <daniel> someone who could the mac datepicker madness, too, maybe joey
[19:37] <ctalbert> Archaeopteryx: do you have a mac?  Could you take a first look at this?
[19:37] <ssitter> afaik bug 356505 is fixed on trunk
[19:37] <Archaeopteryx> no, i have no mac
[19:38] <Archaeopteryx> ssitter: because trunk has it's own date picker from gecko?
[19:38] <ctalbert> ssitter: that's interesting. 
[19:39] <ssitter> no, the entire popup handling was changed in Gecko 1.9
[19:39] <ctalbert> If that's what it takes to fix this....we're in trouble on the branch.
[19:39] <mschroeder> We have to remove our popup hacks from trunk sometime.
[19:40] <ssitter> I think mvl mentioned this some tine ago but there were no trunk builds for testing
[19:41] <mschroeder> I think we have no chance to fix those datepicker bugs on branch without some ugly hacks.
[19:44] * ulf_ (ulf@moz-4811E34E.staroffice.de) Quit (Ping timeout)
[19:45] <ctalbert> Well, we're on branch for a while, so ugly hack or no, they need to be fixed.
[19:45] <ctalbert> I think they should block
[19:46] <mschroeder> agreed
[19:46] <daniel> +1
[19:47] <mschroeder> Our time is up. This is the end of the QA chat.