SeaMonkey Meeting Details
- Time: 11 October, 2016, 12:00 UTC
- (8am Eastern, 1pm UK, 2pm Central Europe, 8pm Hong Kong)
- Location: #seamonkey IRC channel
- Further Read: Basics
- Participants (in order of appearance): Ratty, frg, IanN, rsx11m, Lee, Callek_cloud9
- Who's taking minutes? -> frg
- Nominees for Friends of the Fish Tank:
- ewong and acting as his sidekick frg for trying to fix l10n repack
(who needs to do what that hasn't been recorded in a bug) We should assign people to the open items.
- Google announced V4 of the safebrowsing api. No actions currently needed. Firefox adds support for it in bug 1167038.
- Google API key for Safe Browsing. Ewong/Callek about getting it loaded onto the build machines.
- Per bug 903439#c10, ewong has a Google API key (stating that for Geolocation service). Safe Browsing keys are on the builders according to ewong. The build configs are currently being reviewed.
- IanN has spoken to mcsmurf about members list. Members mailing-list and council appointments are ready to be reviewed.
- TODO: Add Adrian Kalla to RelEng team. Overall no change as of today
- IanN SeaMonkey project areas is very outdated. IanN did circulate a new version of the project areas and is asking for feedback.
- frg suggests a tabbrowser.xml overhaul because it's becoming harder to backport fixes from Firefox.
- IanN suggests doing small patches which are easier to review.
Status of the SeaMonkey Buildbot Master and Tree
- Various Bugs open for building.
- OSX64: busted due to bug 1260362. Yasm 1.2 needs to be installed.
- Perma-busted-red: bug 958812
- Linux64 Nightly: bug 1275215 is still open but Linux is building most of the time.
- Linux64 build: bug 1275218 is still open but Linux is building most of the time.
- Windows building on the loaner works.
- Various l10n and other bugs bug 1293943 which might also impact the release schedule. Currently no clear overview available.
- OSX64: busted due to bug 1260362. Yasm 1.2 needs to be installed.
- [11th October 2016]
- Callek: Regarding the windows systems, sadly no progress yet. I'm hopeful we can get done sooner than later, I'm realistic expecting it won't be any time soon.
- Ewong will set up a cron job to do semi regular builds on the loaner machine. He is still unable to set a timeframe for the next release. The moco build system is constantly changing. The MAC builders can be updated to OSX 10.9. He needs to consult with Callek first about this. He has trouble building the Windows version on the loaner.
- Windows nightly trunk builds are unavailable due to various bugs such as bug 1092468 and bug 1108970. Migrating our Windows builders to Win2008 and our compiler toolchain to VS2015 would likely solve this and other bustages. Ewong made substantial progress here and building works on the loaner.
- There are also some upcoming changes to l10n build system in Q1 2015 (bug 1107635).
- Langpacks aren't updated when auto-updating SeaMonkey because they aren't uploaded to AMO. The solution requires changes in SeaMonkey RelEng (and possibly AMO).
- wrt bug 1155011, we already have a Soccoro token. The patches on bug 1155013 require approval and then pushed and the work-around patches backed out.
- See RelEng page for the RelEng status history.
Fixed Stuff Since Last Meeting
- Next release will be 2.46 (in progress!), tracked in bug 1294433
- Currently, 2.46 has hit the proverbial repack brick wall. (bug 1231349)
- Release notes in bug 1302639 need helping hands.
- Setting the default search engine no longer works. This is covered in bug 1265881 and will not be fixed for 2.46. It needs to be added to the release notes.
- bug 1231349 is currently causing problems building l10n versions. Currently only a workaround exists.
- bug 1279851 CRASH when benchmarking webm decoding performance on YouTube page. Fixed in bug 1279348 which is in 2.47+. If possible it should be included in a special m-r SeaMonkey release branch for 2.46.
- gtk3 will be disabled in the release build in bug 1213152.
- Backup plan in case we need it is to do some releases off comm-esr52. These would be 2.49.x releases. No current plans until Mozilla suddenly removes full theme support or anything else which would severely break SeaMonkey.
- Patches which do not concern Thunderbird could be checked into comm-esr52 (once established) after getting approval too.
- Thunderbird solved l10n issues with their 49.0 beta, hopefully that procedure is transplantable to SeaMonkey.
- Useful Firefox Release Schedule link: Releases Scheduling
Extensions and Plugins Compatibility Tracking
- Firefox plans to disallow all NPAPI plugins other than Flash with Gecko 52 (bug 1269807, , ).
- builds will receive a run-time check ignoring (i.e., not loading) all plugins other than Flash.
- SeaMonkey might release a 2.49 ESR build based on FF 52 ESR code. Nothing decided yet.
- any workarounds or code in dom/plugins specific to other plugins may be subsequently removed.
- See Basics page. Please only list current changes here.
- Addons are now compatible by default. The code in the addon manager that complains about incompatible version numbers has been removed. This should reduce the friction of installing older addons.
- Addon Compatibility Listings (outdated), alternative list started (currently Rainer Bielefeld is the only active maintainer)
- We are looking for a new place to host the Addon Compatibility Listings for the Add-on Converter in order to make it easy to maintain and to serve as the main database for the AMO browsing extension in the future. The details are in this post.
- Firefox & Thunderbird Add-on Converter for SeaMonkey http://addonconverter.fotokraina.com/
This tool goes a little further beyond simply modifying install.rdf - it also identifies a few more other things in the code that are Firefox or Thunderbird specific and attempts to change them. Of course, not all extensions can be ported so easily to SeaMonkey since there's only so much an automated tool like that can do.
- Lemon Juice continues to improve his already impressive Addon Converter. The source is now available on GitHub .
- We are looking for a better(?) home for extension-converter pages, along with a way to track successful and conversion-failed add-ons, and respective integration into SeaMonkey by add-on or manager overlay , bug 1145026.
- Ratty filed bug 1130390 to add a link on seamonkey-projects.org to the Firefox & Thunderbird Add-on Converter for SeaMonkey.
- The AMO Browsing for SeaMonkey extension, which makes AMO pages a lot more SeaMonkey-friendly, is mature. It was developed by LemonJuice (of Add-on Converter fame), and Tonymec, who tested it and now uses it, supports it enthusiastically. The author proposes to add it as a "built-in extension" besides ChatZilla, DOMi and the like. What do you think? (See also Bug 1145026: AMO Add-On-Descriptions: Add link function leading to SeaMonkey add-on-converter and filling URL input pane; the extension actually does much more than the bug's Summary implies: for instance it gets rid of the stupid "You need Firefox 10 or later" popups.
- The HTML Validator extension has been updated on June 28 and again (but Beta) on July 2. The Beta version is no more Windows-only: it boasts support for W32/64, L32/64 and Mac 32/64 Universal in a single XPI. It does not officially support trunk builds but in Tonymec's experience it works with them (or at least with the "latest" 2016-06-25 tinderbox-build). It offers a choice of validators: Tidy, SGML (same algorithm as the W3C validator but client-side) or both. Caveat: The toolbar button gives no results for HTML5, you need View Source for that. See the developer's site for details.
- Some warning messages might be caused by improper toolkit checking for disabled signing. See bug 1291749.
2.x (Last, Current, Next)
- SeaMonkey Statistics can be viewed at https://dataviz.mozilla.org Across all channels we have an approximate ADU of 120k.
- Ratty suggests embedding these graphs somewhere on seamonkey-projects.org or https://dev.seamonkey.at
- bug 1133728 Look at embedding dataviz information into the SeaMonkey website.
- Links are broken again. Dataviz views now needs a SSO login. We need to find out how to expose a limited view for public consumption bug 1173006.
- See Basics page for the usual reminders.
2.40 current release
2.46 planned upcoming release
- We need someone to work on porting sync 1.5 over to replace legacy sync code. Frg was distracted by other bugs and tasks and didn't look into it yet.
See: New Firefox Sync has landed in Firefox Nightly. Tracked in:
- Stalled. Needs a kick:
- Current breakages:
- bug 1300547 Form Autocomplete broken by bug 1294502. See also bug 1296338. Working patch is up and frg will adopt it further for SeaMonkeys autocomplete.
- bug 1299920 'release weak references in the IMAP protocol on the main thread' causes problems with IMAP in Nightly and debug builds until fixed starting with 2.48a1. rkent is looking into this.
- Mozilla-central bugs that affect us:
- bug 1298243 'drag/drop: DataTransfer.types is wrong type'. Building SeaMonkey still works but changes probably need to be ported.
- bug 1276739 'replace list.txt with a region-aware JSON file format to allow different search configs...'. Regressions for SeaMonkey are tracked in bug 1300198.
- Firefox has changed the styles of several Toolkit pages to their "in-content" designs which however look very out of place in our current classic and modern themes.
- Subsequent to Chameleon, Firefox developers have again redesigned the about:privatebrowsing UI to include UI for tracking protection. We should look into picking any changes we like.
- about:addons yet to come bug 1222817
- Toolkit meta bug for about:* pages: bug 1097111 - SeaMonkey tracking in bug 1133743.
- Modern may need updating as IDs are changing, Default needs forking if we want to roll back to previous styles.
- A lot of these bugs are due to mozilla-central switching from synchronous APIs to Asynchronous APIs.
- bug 566746 (asyncFormHistory) Form history should use asynchronous storage API. Tracked in:
- bug 912031 Use Asynchronous FormHistory.jsm in place of nsIFormHistory2 in Suite. Currently being worked on by IanN.
- The C++ downloads manager backend nsIDownloadManager is being decommissioned. Firefox and Thunderbird have migrated to jsdownloads.
- The SSL/TLS Preference Pane has been updated to offer TLS 1.3 (bug 1267631).
- There is still considerable activity in TLS 1.3 core work. This will ride the release train, thus allowing users to enable it for testing, hopefully it'll be ready when trunk hits release.
security.tls.version.maxremains 3 for TLS 1.2 for the time being. A test server  is available.
- bug 1198340 The carousel within Add-On Manager can be used for SeaMonkey specific content.
- [Ratty] The url for the discovery pane is set in a pref. Firefox has switched to https://discovery.addons. Instantbird points the URL to a chrome XUL document. If we do this we don't have to worry about the python stuff. The new Firefox discovery page will not serve up featured addons for SeaMonkey so we are sticking with services.* at least until they stop serving that up.
- This bug is dead as the next iteration of AMO will not be offering seamonkey specific content. Will be removed from the next status meeting notes.
- [Ratty] made some progress to fix bug 1222817 - Restore about:addons UI (Addons Manager) to old appearance. He found some useful ideas from the CSS in https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/seamonkey/addon/classicish-addon-manager/ but currently doesn't have the time to continue.
- bug 1300198 Move list.txt over to JSON once bug 1276739 will likely break search engines and needs to be looked at.
- [frg] suggested to match SeaMonkeys minor version number with then one from Firefox in a future release. This need to be looked into first because some external releng or other stuff might rely on the -3 version offset.
- [adriank] would like to drop DOMi or at least not bundling it with release builds in bug 1273222. Open for discussion.
- [ewong] stated that SeaMonkey needs to move to balrog which is the the new updates server/format to do a future 2.47 release.
- [rsx11m] did open bug bug 1305902 for certificate pinning. Discussion if it should be enabled for SeaMonkey is still underway. Callek commented in the bug after the status meeting.
Feature List, Planning
Bug statistics for the last two (full) weeks: 36 new, 9 fixed, 10 triaged.
- medium triaging effort, larger than average number of new bugs files.
- See Feature List page for major wanted/needed features.
- Encrypted Media Extensions / Digital Rights Management
- bug 1127784 added a preference and UI to enable/disable playback of Encrypted Media Extensions, with UI seen in non-release builds only
- More work appears to be needed to download necessary 3rd-party Content Decryption Modules, some UI can probably be ported from Firefox
- Encrypted Media Extensions / Digital Rights Management
- Mozilla wants to Move Thunderbird off MoCo infrastructure and onto their own, which will likely affect SeaMonkey as well
- [Ratty:] Thunderbird developers appear to be agreeable for SeaMonkey to tag along with Thunderbird. This might fix our problem with lack of builders and our PERMA-CLOSED trees due to this lack.
- discussions in mozilla.governance, mozilla.dev.apps.seamonkey, tb-planning, blog.lizardwrangler.com
- Blog post Firefox and Thunderbird: A Fork in the Road
- Separating the infrastructure: Build and release: Mozilla's offer.
- More recent posts/discussions:
- Fundamental core features Firefox/Mozilla plans to remove:
- bug 1269807 Remove support for all NPAPI plugins (except Flash)
- for Gecko 52+ retail, not for 52 ESR branch
- Gecko 51 will be the last version supporting Windows XP and probably Vista too.
- This is tracked in bug 1130266. Support for it is moved to ESR 52 in bug 1303827. The plan still needs to be approved from Mozilla management. Statistics show that there are still as many XP users using Firefox as there are Linux and macOS users.
- If approved SeaMonkey 2.48 (or 2.49 if built from ESR) and Firefox 51 will be the last retail versions running on WinXP.
- At the current time getting 2.46 out is priority one. After release there are several options open which have been discussed. What to do will be decided later:
- Do ESR and regular releases. Due to a shortage of manpower participants are not sure if this is feasible.
- Drop XP support with providing an unofficial ESR release optionally.
- Switch to ESR releases only. Until now only SeaMonkey 2.35 has been built from the ESR branch. After 2.46 a trial 2.42.x / ESR 45 might be built to see if this still works.
- There is currently no progress in the bugs and we need to decide later. frg suggests doing a separate status meeting for this when Mozillas plans become clearer.
- bug 1222546 Product plan: remove support for heavyweight themes
- If effective for all Toolkit applications, would render most 3rd-party themes defunct.
- Discussion diverted to https://discourse.mozilla-community.org/t/planning-the-future-of-complete-themes/
- No news about it till now.
- bug 1269807 Remove support for all NPAPI plugins (except Flash)
- Rainer started a Coffee-Mug-Competition: . Please let any developers you know to it and post a big Help wanted! sign.
- [Ratty] suggests shipping The HTML Validator as a bundled extension.
- SeaMonkey Composer is outdated. Ratty thinks that using backports or parts of KompoZer  might solve some of the problems.
- x64 Linux and for the first time x64 Windows builds will be made official as soon as possible.
- The website and wiki are outdated. InvisibleSmiley no longer maintains the website. For 2.46 the website needs to be updated.
- bug 1253932 tracked the relnotes for 2.40 and could be used as a start point.
- mcsmurf knows how to change the site.
- frg suggested asking for donations in a future release. Probably during startup or more prominently on the website.
Roundtable - Personal Status Updates
Ratty or IanN will handle review requests.
Status Updates from developers - what are you working on, what's the progress, any other comments? (feel free to add yourself to the list if your name is missing and you have interesting status).
- working on the 2.46 so only had a slight deviation from the release bugs to do a bit of the following:
- bug 1309126 - nsMsgComposeSecure.cpp: error : no match for 'operator!='
- majority of the time was finding how to unhork our release builds and (currently) repacks thanks to:
- bug 1306543 - gfxFontconfigFonts.cpp error
- bug 1307324 - WebGLContextDraw.cpp error..
- bug 1231349 -- L10n repacks broken
- bug 1293943 which seemingly affects the Windows l10n release repacks and not the linux ones.
- bug 1305909 - fingerprinting issues from hg.mo.
- and OPERATION MAINTAIN_MY_SANITY, which basically is keeping my sanity from slipping away thanks to these bugs which are preventing us from releasing anything yesterday...
Whether this is off the record or on the record, I just want to state that 2.46 has got to be the MOST PAINFUL release I've taken part of and we haven't even gotten to the UPDATES craziness...
Waiting for review or feedback:
- bug 1282227 Port Bug 1071880 and Bug 1142937 to SeaMonkey: Notifiy users of slow addons. Unable to test. Either not working or I am missing something.
- bug 1293618 "Clear History from Private Data" completely broken (only test part left).
- bug 1296839 Minor Tabbrowser.xml cleanups and changes.
- bug 1296850 Show standard loading indicator images in tab when busy or progress attribute are set. ON the backburner. Need to look at the icons.
- bug 1300547 Suggestion list dropdown with suggestions not shown.
- bug 1308273 Temporary enable all plugins in SeaMonkey 2.49.
- bug 1308741 obsolete URL in userChrome-example.css & userContent-example.css.
- bug 521861 After creating news account through clicking news URL Account Wizard is broken.
- bug 1256724 Update The Data Manager, and the Cookie Viewer so as to treat backspace and delete equivalently on Mac OS X. Took over the bug. Need to figure out some backspace problems in cookieviewer
- bug 1238767 Localized Suite build fails in DebugQA: Stalled. I think the l10 build system might be responsible and tries to pick up files from the wrong location. Adrian Kalla thinks I need to do an l10 merge only. I disagree because the xpi only explicitly supports en-US builds.
- This and that. Updated some de help items. Worked in my free time mostly on bug 1231349 and bug 1300547.
- No time for Sync at the moment.
Other things on my mind:
- --enable-optimize=-O2 should be used for Windows release builds. Linux gcc --enable-optimize optimizes for speed. With VS2015 it optimizes for size. Resulting O2 Windows build feels a lot snappier.
- bug 1244467 Localized Builds: ChatZilla language pack missing from SeaMonkey installer package will not be fixed by bug 1210791. mozmake installer under Windows includes the l10n xpi in local builds. Adrian posted a build log and I looked at it. Seems to be l10n-merge related.
I will not participate, mut may be you want to discuss Problem with many outdated areas at SeaMonkey website? Due to his own words Jens Hatlak no longer is active reviewer, and there is no regular maintenance for the website. Every now and then someone tells he would be interested in working on that, but mostly those volunteers are not persevering, do not follwo (my) advice, ... . May be someone can help Amit singh to set-up dev environment for SeaMonkey so that he can try to do some trivial fixes?
- Move the nsPlacesAutocomplete component to Suite.
- bug 1280698 Package EmojiOne TTF font on Linux and Windows.
- bug 1298487 Modern theme for about:networking.
- Did some reviews and approvals.
- Bug triage and Bug discussions.
- Usual end user support and PR in newsgroups and Mozillazine.
- bug 1296433 Improve button appearance in about:support UI (Troubleshooting Information) with the default theme
- follows up on bug 1222818
- bug 493217 add UI pref for media.autoplay.enabled
- not exactly clear where this is supposed to go
- bug 1305902 consider enabling public key pinning on Seamonkey
- bug 1307773 Manage Identities window is too tall to fit monitor screen (MailNews)
Awaiting new patch for ui-review:
- bug 1298487 Modern theme for about:networking
- Bug triage, testing, and commenting for SeaMonkey and MailNews Core.
- End-user information and discussion on MozillaZine.
Any other business?